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krimsunmunkeys
Joined: 16 Feb 2006 Posts: 1333 Location: The Hall of the SH Council... watching... (not really)
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 3:42 am Post subject: |
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I'm bored, so I'll go test this out for you. |
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MaximusDM
Joined: 13 Feb 2006 Posts: 876 Location: Massapequa, New York
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 4:03 am Post subject: |
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krimsunmunkeys wrote: | I'm bored, so I'll go test this out for you. |
<3 _________________
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Echelar
Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 1246 Location: Fort Wayne, IN
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 4:06 am Post subject: |
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I've never been able to use it *immediately* after getting it. I think the time discrepancy is that it takes a few milliseconds for the meter to actually fill, and the message to come on screen. If there's at least an 8th pause, I can usually squeeze it off if I try enough times. _________________
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krimsunmunkeys
Joined: 16 Feb 2006 Posts: 1333 Location: The Hall of the SH Council... watching... (not really)
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 4:30 am Post subject: |
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Echelar wrote: | I think the time discrepancy is that it takes a few milliseconds for the meter to actually fill, and the message to come on screen. |
That's exactly what it is.
I tested it in Frankenstein Easy (as MDM was playing) and in Get Ready 2 Rokk Easy to test the possiblilty of a delay affected by a tempo variable. However, I found that that is not true, as the delay I got in Frankenstein was about one 8th note long, while the delay in Get Ready 2 Rokk was about three 8th notes long.
Throwing out the tempo variable, I went to the song that I found myself pulling off instant SP: Heart Full of Black Expert. I found that I had the same delay, something I didn't notice before.
Then it popped into my head. The intro to Heart Full of Black has a nice long SP note that was the perfect place to test my idea (not that I'm stealing credit for your idea Echelar: I came up with it before I saw your post). When you finish an SP streak and get the 25% SP boost, it doesn't just increase 25% in one frame. It has to rise, which can take a small moment to do.
I whammied the first note for 8 beats and finished the streak, then started over, whammying the note for 13 beats instead. When the bar was almost filled from the 13 beats of whammying, the delay was almost gone.
Conclusion:
The delay lasts until the moment the bar hits the 50% mark, and therefore is shorter if the bar is already 49% filled. |
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Echelar
Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 1246 Location: Fort Wayne, IN
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 5:05 am Post subject: |
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I'd never really thought about the 49% + another combo being different from 25% + another combo, but it makes sense.
It also explains why I never have trouble using SP really fast when I'm whammying out the half bar instead of getting it from just a normal sequence.
Yet another variable to include in the program JCirri and I are (slowly) working on... _________________
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Echelar
Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 1246 Location: Fort Wayne, IN
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 5:45 am Post subject: |
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For a visual illustration:
(this is Ace of Spades by the way)
Test 1: 25% -> 50%
Before hitting the SP:
After hitting the SP, while it's filling the bar:
Elapsed time: 1 thin line
Bar filled up to 50%:
Elapsed time: ~1.5 thin lines
When I managed to use the SP:
Elapsed time: 2 thin lines = 1 bold line
Test #2: 49% -> 50%
Same place. I had almost a half bar from whammying the first SP of the song almost up to half. Got it and used it as fast as I could:
Elapsed time: 1/4 thin line?
_________________
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JCirri
Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 4576
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:00 am Post subject: |
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After analyzing PS2 video output frame-by-frame. It seems regardless of tempo it always takes 10 frames to fill the meter by 25% and 11 frames before the message pops up.
At 29.97 Hz, this means 10 frames = 0.333 secs
So esentially it takes a third of a second for star power to fill up after completing a starpower combo.
I also noticed that it begins filling the meter as soon as you hit the last note (not necessarilly at the note's true location, if you hit the note early or late). _________________
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Echelar
Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 1246 Location: Fort Wayne, IN
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:07 am Post subject: |
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While testing the "does it fill up as soon as you hit it" question, I was able to redo test #2...
I hit the note early, and used SP as fast as possible. What resulted was that I had SP going before I even crossed the line that the note was on.
The line is a bit hard to see, the pic was taken from a paused VCR... look on the edges of the fret board around the orange circle and you can see the note line.
_________________
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JCirri
Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 4576
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 7:00 am Post subject: |
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I've just confirmed the star power meter fills up after completing a combo 25% within 0.333 secs.
I've also been testing the allowable timing windows for hitting notes. It seems the timing window corresponds to the amount of time that a note overlaps the fret icons at the bottom of the screen. This implies that the timing window is dependent on the scroll rate of the screen which is different for each difficulty. Hence the timing window is smaller on Expert and larger on Easy (since notes will be overlapping the fret icons for a longer period of time on Easy).
Based on analyzing frames, I've calculated the timing window on expert to be 0.1667 secs (a sixth of a second).
Note that this is exactly half of the time it takes to fill SP after finishing a combo (a third of a second).
However, after further testing, this relationship between the rate of SP filling up and the timing window does not hold true for other difficulties. While the timing window becomes larger for easier difficulties, the rate at which the SP meter fills up remains constant (25% within 0.333 secs).
This may sound confusing, but I wanted to document my results on here so I have them to develop my optimal scoring program as accurately as possible. _________________
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MaximusDM
Joined: 13 Feb 2006 Posts: 876 Location: Massapequa, New York
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 9:08 am Post subject: |
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Echelar wrote: | Yet another variable to include in the program JCirri and I are (slowly) working on... |
Luckily I brought it up then, eh? ^_^ _________________
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JCirri
Joined: 04 Feb 2006 Posts: 4576
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 10:27 am Post subject: |
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MaximusDM wrote: | Luckily I brought it up then, eh? ^_^ |
Indeed. That was a nice observation I would've never thought to test otherwise.
This program just keeps getting more and more complex every day with new variables being discovered. _________________
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krimsunmunkeys
Joined: 16 Feb 2006 Posts: 1333 Location: The Hall of the SH Council... watching... (not really)
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Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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Nice. I don't have the equipment to test things frame by frame. |
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IEatGlue
Joined: 16 Jul 2006 Posts: 769 Location: Waterford, Michigan
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Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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tru.dat _________________
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Dandaman
Joined: 27 Jun 2006 Posts: 237 Location: Australia
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Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 6:01 am Post subject: |
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jeez u really have to know your math to work for scorehero XD |
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b3nz0r
Joined: 18 Jul 2006 Posts: 972 Location: Harker Heights, TX
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Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 7:55 am Post subject: |
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This stuff is very interesting. Great research, Ech/JC. _________________
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